| Re: long term future for overhead wires? Posted by Electric train at 18:42, 23rd May 2026 |     |
It's coming up to 9 years since Grayling killed parts of Great Western electrification (it was July 2017)
As photographed above there are a number of masts west of Chippenham doing nothing. I think about third of the mast bases and a few masts were also installed Didcot - Oxford.
Things have moved on with cost control, and the stupidity of not resuming it once costs were controlled has never really made sense as a long term strategy (and even less so in new era of high diesel prices).
Ironically the delay to ordering replacements for 158,159,165,166,168 diesel fleet might benefit a few electrified sections, if it means battery charging is possible, and don't have to fit diesel engines (which require servicing and maintenance of the engines). There is obviously a cost implication of adding diesel generators to replacement fleet (plus ongoing extra operational costs), which could be used to pay for some of the electrification instead.
But doing joined up thinking, or any form of mid or longer term planning seems to be beyond current batch of ministers, who seem to be more into short term thinking and regular U turns
As photographed above there are a number of masts west of Chippenham doing nothing. I think about third of the mast bases and a few masts were also installed Didcot - Oxford.
Things have moved on with cost control, and the stupidity of not resuming it once costs were controlled has never really made sense as a long term strategy (and even less so in new era of high diesel prices).
Ironically the delay to ordering replacements for 158,159,165,166,168 diesel fleet might benefit a few electrified sections, if it means battery charging is possible, and don't have to fit diesel engines (which require servicing and maintenance of the engines). There is obviously a cost implication of adding diesel generators to replacement fleet (plus ongoing extra operational costs), which could be used to pay for some of the electrification instead.
But doing joined up thinking, or any form of mid or longer term planning seems to be beyond current batch of ministers, who seem to be more into short term thinking and regular U turns
Why was it stopped? Was it way behind schedule and/or over budget?
Was going seriously over budget, (and behind schedule) and instead of saying pause and refocus, just took axe to it. Ignored the ongoing alternative costs it created.
It was a time when skills were being outsourced to consultants, so something like a drain cover where a mast was planned, meant leaving it, getting consultants out again, redesigning, expensively coming back later with electrification train. Rather than having skilled and empowered staff doing simple tweak to plan there and then.
The structure at the time was not incentivised to get it finished as efficiently as possible, but was more like see what extra work and revenue can get from it. HS2 contracts were devised in same cost plus era too.
Agreed the GW electrification went over budget, however the DfT got the electrification the specified but then complained it was too expensive and taking too long. Also they dithered over the Oxford station rebuild and failed to take on the NIMBY in Bath and Chippenham area may be there were a few MP's worried about their seats
| Re: Overhead Line Equipment - ongoing discussion Posted by Chris from Nailsea at 17:14, 23rd May 2026 | |
I have merged a couple of topics here, in the interests of continuity, clarity and ease of future reference.
CfN.
| Re: long term future for overhead wires? Posted by John D at 08:24, 23rd May 2026 | |
It's coming up to 9 years since Grayling killed parts of Great Western electrification (it was July 2017)
As photographed above there are a number of masts west of Chippenham doing nothing. I think about third of the mast bases and a few masts were also installed Didcot - Oxford.
Things have moved on with cost control, and the stupidity of not resuming it once costs were controlled has never really made sense as a long term strategy (and even less so in new era of high diesel prices).
Ironically the delay to ordering replacements for 158,159,165,166,168 diesel fleet might benefit a few electrified sections, if it means battery charging is possible, and don't have to fit diesel engines (which require servicing and maintenance of the engines). There is obviously a cost implication of adding diesel generators to replacement fleet (plus ongoing extra operational costs), which could be used to pay for some of the electrification instead.
But doing joined up thinking, or any form of mid or longer term planning seems to be beyond current batch of ministers, who seem to be more into short term thinking and regular U turns
As photographed above there are a number of masts west of Chippenham doing nothing. I think about third of the mast bases and a few masts were also installed Didcot - Oxford.
Things have moved on with cost control, and the stupidity of not resuming it once costs were controlled has never really made sense as a long term strategy (and even less so in new era of high diesel prices).
Ironically the delay to ordering replacements for 158,159,165,166,168 diesel fleet might benefit a few electrified sections, if it means battery charging is possible, and don't have to fit diesel engines (which require servicing and maintenance of the engines). There is obviously a cost implication of adding diesel generators to replacement fleet (plus ongoing extra operational costs), which could be used to pay for some of the electrification instead.
But doing joined up thinking, or any form of mid or longer term planning seems to be beyond current batch of ministers, who seem to be more into short term thinking and regular U turns
Why was it stopped? Was it way behind schedule and/or over budget?
Was going seriously over budget, (and behind schedule) and instead of saying pause and refocus, just took axe to it. Ignored the ongoing alternative costs it created.
It was a time when skills were being outsourced to consultants, so something like a drain cover where a mast was planned, meant leaving it, getting consultants out again, redesigning, expensively coming back later with electrification train. Rather than having skilled and empowered staff doing simple tweak to plan there and then.
The structure at the time was not incentivised to get it finished as efficiently as possible, but was more like see what extra work and revenue can get from it. HS2 contracts were devised in same cost plus era too.
| Re: long term future for overhead wires? Posted by TaplowGreen at 08:13, 23rd May 2026 | |
It's coming up to 9 years since Grayling killed parts of Great Western electrification (it was July 2017)
As photographed above there are a number of masts west of Chippenham doing nothing. I think about third of the mast bases and a few masts were also installed Didcot - Oxford.
Things have moved on with cost control, and the stupidity of not resuming it once costs were controlled has never really made sense as a long term strategy (and even less so in new era of high diesel prices).
Ironically the delay to ordering replacements for 158,159,165,166,168 diesel fleet might benefit a few electrified sections, if it means battery charging is possible, and don't have to fit diesel engines (which require servicing and maintenance of the engines). There is obviously a cost implication of adding diesel generators to replacement fleet (plus ongoing extra operational costs), which could be used to pay for some of the electrification instead.
But doing joined up thinking, or any form of mid or longer term planning seems to be beyond current batch of ministers, who seem to be more into short term thinking and regular U turns
As photographed above there are a number of masts west of Chippenham doing nothing. I think about third of the mast bases and a few masts were also installed Didcot - Oxford.
Things have moved on with cost control, and the stupidity of not resuming it once costs were controlled has never really made sense as a long term strategy (and even less so in new era of high diesel prices).
Ironically the delay to ordering replacements for 158,159,165,166,168 diesel fleet might benefit a few electrified sections, if it means battery charging is possible, and don't have to fit diesel engines (which require servicing and maintenance of the engines). There is obviously a cost implication of adding diesel generators to replacement fleet (plus ongoing extra operational costs), which could be used to pay for some of the electrification instead.
But doing joined up thinking, or any form of mid or longer term planning seems to be beyond current batch of ministers, who seem to be more into short term thinking and regular U turns
Why was it stopped? Was it way behind schedule and/or over budget?
| Re: long term future for overhead wires? Posted by John D at 08:11, 23rd May 2026 | |
It's coming up to 9 years since Grayling killed parts of Great Western electrification (it was July 2017)
As photographed above there are a number of masts west of Chippenham doing nothing. I think about third of the mast bases and a few masts were also installed Didcot - Oxford.
Things have moved on with cost control, and the stupidity of not resuming it once costs were controlled has never really made sense as a long term strategy (and even less so in new era of high diesel prices).
Ironically the delay to ordering replacements for 158,159,165,166,168 diesel fleet might benefit a few electrified sections, if it means battery charging is possible, and don't have to fit diesel engines (which require servicing and maintenance of the engines). There is obviously a cost implication of adding diesel generators to replacement fleet (plus ongoing extra operational costs), which could be used to pay for some of the electrification instead.
But doing joined up thinking, or any form of mid or longer term planning seems to be beyond current batch of ministers, who seem to be more into short term thinking and regular U turns
| Re: long term future for overhead wires? Posted by grahame at 07:09, 23rd May 2026 | |
As I read it, it's all on "stop" at the moment - no money and no concrete plans to resume. Personal view - it is seen as more important to get people from Acton to Solihull as quickly as possible in 10 years time than it is to complete jobs which in some cases were already started. But yet with advancing technology, that just might make sense.
Works started and - would you describe them as abandoned? - at Thingley Junction.
Personal view - from my armchair - would be the Didcot to Oxford and Cocklebury Lane and Parkway to Temple Meads would be the next sensible steps. So many services would then be able to go pure electric; does not cut the need for power (moves it away from the train) but at least it can be sustainable and not fossil, trains last longer, have better performances curves, and can still electrically do London - Cardiff even when Badminton is closed for engineering or flooding.
Also makes sense for freight to get electric to Westbury and the quarries - via Pewsey and via Melksham - nd that brings in more electric passenger trains too.
| long term future for overhead wires? Posted by infoman at 05:20, 23rd May 2026 | |
Not sure if there are any plans for overhead Electrification in the West region.
Maybe
Stapleton road bank
Chippenham to Bristol
Cardiff to Swansea(possible on to LLanelli and Carmarthen
Although over head wires never look pleasant,especially in pretty view areas
Three places in this neck of the woods I would never like to see overhead wires is St Ives Newquay and Falmouth
with the Severn Beach line and Portishead lines.
Just wondering if the scheme on the Greenford branch could be introduced with underneath charging points at the the terminating station on the five routes mentioned.
| Re: Overhead Line Equipment - ongoing discussion Posted by Electric train at 07:30, 23rd December 2025 | |
I note Mark A's reference to Thingley Junction and the associated OLE terms mentioned. I can recommend Garry Keenor's self published "Overhead Line Electrification for Railways" available both as a pdf and a hard back book. Garry is a Chartered Engineer, have a gander at www.ocs4rail.com. Perhaps I ought to add I have no connection to Gary, just a strictly amateur interest.
My quick glance through the Garry Keenor pfd it is very comprehensive, anyone reading it cover to cover will have a very good understanding of OLE railway electrification.
Although I will add the techniques, equipment and systems are evolving all the time | Re: Overhead Line Equipment - ongoing discussion Posted by Chris from Nailsea at 13:30, 22nd December 2025 | |
As an occasional poster in this forum ... My thanks to Chris from Nailsea for his kind reply ... My apologies if I have posted in the wrong place.
A minor confusion, which I have resolved, BahnCard100.
Thank you for continuing to post such interesting and useful information - no matter how 'occasional'.
| Re: Overhead Line Equipment - ongoing discussion Posted by BahnCard100 at 12:40, 22nd December 2025 | |
As an occasional poster in this forum I would like to continue with my last mention of Garry Keenor, a chartered engineer and author of Overhead Line Electrification for Railways.
Once again I should stress that I do not know Garry personally and I have only an amateur interest in the subject. My thanks to Chris from Nailsea for his kind reply.
To continue I found a YouTube video from a recent (December 2025) Wales & West meeting of the Permanent Way Institution which Garry addressed as professional lead for electrification.
His talk was entitled (I don't) Mind the Gap, in which Garry continues to simplify the use of electrification for traction generally both in overhead supply and in battery stored form. In other words he is explaining what intermittent electrification of railways would mean. I hope others find it as interesting as I did.
My apologies if I have posted in the wrong place.
| Re: Overhead Line Equipment - ongoing discussion Posted by grahame at 03:36, 4th November 2025 | |
Bit of a thread drift here, mods !
Noted - probably worth a split for the visibility benefit of both topics.
| Re: Overhead Line Equipment - ongoing discussion Posted by chuffed at 22:59, 3rd November 2025 | |
Bit of a thread drift here, mods !
| Re: Overhead Line Equipment - ongoing discussion Posted by Chris from Nailsea at 17:55, 3rd November 2025 | |
Thank you for your post, BahnCard100 - and for quoting your source and disclaimer of any commercial interest.
On the Coffee Shop forum, we are delighted to see members posting such links to relevant reference material.
CfN.
| Overhead Line Equipment - ongoing discussion Posted by BahnCard100 at 16:28, 3rd November 2025 | |
I note Mark A's reference to Thingley Junction and the associated OLE terms mentioned. I can recommend Garry Keenor's self published "Overhead Line Electrification for Railways" available both as a pdf and a hard back book. Garry is a Chartered Engineer, have a gander at www.ocs4rail.com. Perhaps I ought to add I have no connection to Gary, just a strictly amateur interest.
