| Re: First Group has acquired Union Trains GWML Holdings Ltd. Posted by ChrisB at 19:11, 7th December 2024 |      |
The ones going to Hull & Lumo will be lengthening services
There's also a further possibility for another 13, should the recent request for Devon services come to fruition
| Re: First Group has acquired Union Trains GWML Holdings Ltd. Posted by ray951 at 14:06, 6th December 2024 | |
First Group has signed a 10 year lease for 14 5-car trains from Hitachi, these are a mixture of electric, battery electric and bi-mode.
These are for London - Carmarthen, Hull Trains and Lumo.
No 7 or 9 car trains, so unless these are running as 2 x 5 car trains; more short trains taking up valuable paths.
| Re: First Group has acquired Union Trains GWML Holdings Ltd. Posted by ray951 at 09:26, 6th December 2024 | |
I am not yet convinced that Open Access operators are beneficial:
1) They do not cover the full costs of their services; their track access charges are lower than those of a Train Operating Company (TOC).
2) They cherry-pick routes. If that is not the case, why do all Open Access (OA) operators only run fast services to London?
There are no commuter or cross-country services (e.g., Liverpool – Newcastle, Leicester - Manchester, Birmingham – Portsmouth).
3) Open Access reminds me of the early days of bus deregulation, where multiple operators offered cheap fares on the busiest routes.
It was great at the time but disastrous in the long term.
4) The purpose of Great British Railways (GBR) is to simplify the railway structure and reunite train and track operations. Open Access separates them out again.
5) Another reason for GBR is fare simplification, but Open Access complicates the fare structure.
6) The presence of Open Access operators with contracted paths makes changing timetables difficult, as the East Coast Main Line (ECML) is currently experiencing, and they occupy valuable paths with short trains.
7) Are there enough paths between Reading and London for all these services? If not, which services will be cut?
8 ) Passengers from intermediate stations, where these trains won’t stop, will receive a poorer service.
9) Will non-Open Access fares (and especially those on routes where OA doesn’t run services) have to increase to cover the revenue loss to Open Access?
10) It would be ironic that GWR would have drivers working on a Sunday with Lumo that they have single-handedly failed to manage over the last 20+ years with GWR.
| Re: First Group has acquired Union Trains GWML Holdings Ltd. Posted by Electric train at 08:51, 6th December 2024 | |
I am not sure that Open Access operators can easily co-exist with GBR, and are they just cherry picking?
Yes they will, GBR services will be the regulated passenger service, also GBR will be governed by the requirements of the DfT as such GBR will have to make a business case for additional services / routes. The Government also see the open access operators providing competition to the "state" run services the theory being keeping costs down and quality up
| Re: First Group has acquired Union Trains GWML Holdings Ltd. Posted by Timmer at 22:08, 5th December 2024 | |
I can see Bristol and Bath non stop to Paddington being very popular. Reminds me of the ‘West Country Pullman’ that ran between Paddington and Paignton first/last stop Bath Spa from May 1988 until the early 90’s when gradually more stops were added, the Pullman name & restaurant service dropped and it not going any further than Bristol.
I’m not Firstgroup’s biggest fan, far from it in fact, but what they’ve accomplished through operating their Lumo service between London and Edinburgh they deserve a lot of credit for. It would be good to see that success repeated to Wales and the West Country.
| Re: First Group has acquired Union Trains GWML Holdings Ltd. Posted by ChrisB at 18:03, 5th December 2024 | |
From Railnews
First aims for Devon after completing Grand Union deal
FirstGroup is stepping up its open access ambitions by completing the buyout of Grand Union Trains and bidding for a new route to Somerset and Devon.
First now owns Grand Union Trains GWML Holdings Limited, which has rights for open access services between London Paddington and Carmarthen, calling at Bristol Parkway, Newport, Severn Tunnel Junction, Cardiff Central, Gowerton and Llanelli from December 2027.
First is also asking the Office of Rail and Road today for five daily return paths between London and Paignton, calling at Bath Spa, Bristol Temple Meads, Taunton, Exeter St David’s and Torquay from May 2028, as well as a sixth path between Highbridge & Burnham and London. Both the Carmarthen and Paignton routes would be branded Lumo.
The Group said it expected the new services to be turning over £50 million after two years, and that it is currently ‘considering rolling stock options’.
The move is the latest in a flurry of open access applications from the private sector, which have been made as the Government moves ahead with nationalising all remaining contracted passenger operators, starting with South Western Railway in May.
First has already gained open access rights between London and Stirling, and wants to extend its London-Edinburgh Lumo route to Glasgow.
FirstGroup chief executive officer Graham Sutherland said: ‘Growing our open access rail portfolio is a key priority for FirstGroup. The introduction of our new Carmarthen to London Paddington service will significantly bolster our footprint, and should our other applications be successful, we will almost treble our current open access capacity over the next few years.’
FirstGroup is stepping up its open access ambitions by completing the buyout of Grand Union Trains and bidding for a new route to Somerset and Devon.
First now owns Grand Union Trains GWML Holdings Limited, which has rights for open access services between London Paddington and Carmarthen, calling at Bristol Parkway, Newport, Severn Tunnel Junction, Cardiff Central, Gowerton and Llanelli from December 2027.
First is also asking the Office of Rail and Road today for five daily return paths between London and Paignton, calling at Bath Spa, Bristol Temple Meads, Taunton, Exeter St David’s and Torquay from May 2028, as well as a sixth path between Highbridge & Burnham and London. Both the Carmarthen and Paignton routes would be branded Lumo.
The Group said it expected the new services to be turning over £50 million after two years, and that it is currently ‘considering rolling stock options’.
The move is the latest in a flurry of open access applications from the private sector, which have been made as the Government moves ahead with nationalising all remaining contracted passenger operators, starting with South Western Railway in May.
First has already gained open access rights between London and Stirling, and wants to extend its London-Edinburgh Lumo route to Glasgow.
FirstGroup chief executive officer Graham Sutherland said: ‘Growing our open access rail portfolio is a key priority for FirstGroup. The introduction of our new Carmarthen to London Paddington service will significantly bolster our footprint, and should our other applications be successful, we will almost treble our current open access capacity over the next few years.’
hmmm....
five daily return paths between London and Paignton, calling at Bath Spa, Bristol Temple Meads, Taunton, Exeter St David’s and Torquay from May 2028
- the ORR/DfT might have concerns over revenue extraction by providing fast non-stop London<->Bath Spa services, and competition to XC's BRI<->Exter/Paignton services| Re: First Group has acquired Union Trains GWML Holdings Ltd. Posted by ChrisB at 17:59, 5th December 2024 | |
Go-Op might be an interesting target.....
It wouldn't surprise me if one team are oiling the 'other' - but likely at a level that won't be TUPE-ing over to OLR. So why not? They are being paid a management fee to operate a service. As long as that is happening....
| Re: First Group has acquired Union Trains GWML Holdings Ltd. Posted by grahame at 14:21, 5th December 2024 | |
First Group has acquired Union Trains GWML Holdings Ltd.
The planned Paddington - Carmarthen trains will run from Dec 2027 under the Lumo brand.
They have also requested 5 Paddington - Paignton paths and 1 Paddington - Highbridge and Burnham paths.
I am not sure that Open Access operators can easily co-exist with GBR, and are they just cherry picking?
The planned Paddington - Carmarthen trains will run from Dec 2027 under the Lumo brand.
They have also requested 5 Paddington - Paignton paths and 1 Paddington - Highbridge and Burnham paths.
I am not sure that Open Access operators can easily co-exist with GBR, and are they just cherry picking?
There appears to be every intent to have open access co-exist with GBR, and I'm seeing growing evidence that the First strategy is to continue to operate trains once the current operating contracts end, with added services.
There are all sorts of intersting questions, such as whether there's any conflict of interest within the First group between the GWR contract and the future Lumo operation, and whether the current GWR team will be oiling the wheels for there future First operation. I also find myself wondering if First may be wondering whether they could / should be thinking about looking to take over / buy a substantial proportion of other open access companies with ORR rights in our area. First could certainly provide funding if, for example, track upgrades are needed for the services to tun.
| First Group has acquired Union Trains GWML Holdings Ltd. Posted by ray951 at 09:52, 5th December 2024 | |
First Group has acquired Union Trains GWML Holdings Ltd.
The planned Paddington - Carmarthen trains will run from Dec 2027 under the Lumo brand.
They have also requested 5 Paddington - Paignton paths and 1 Paddington - Highbridge and Burnham paths.
I am not sure that Open Access operators can easily co-exist with GBR, and are they just cherry picking?
